Channel strips - do they kill other plugins?

De Pepper · May 21, 2017

Has your killer strip(s) killed your need for other plugins?

I've come across more than a handful of interweb qoutes saying "I could mix a whole album with just this channel strip (except reverbs etc.)" - but could you guys, really?

I mean, what do you guys who own the Vision, 88RS or SSL do with all your other pre, comp, eq and filter plugins of which I assume most of you - like myself - have more than two to pick from

?

On which type of tracks do you find yourself using channel strip plugins exclusively and why?

Thanks for your insights!

calimike · May 21, 2017

Oh I thought this was gonna be about how channel strips generally don't sound good, and asking if using them would kill the benefits of other plugins like Studer, 1176, etc. To that, I'd say maybe. Lots of wisdom in Albini's description of an SSL console, that the more modules you engage, the worse it sounds.

jonschmitz · May 21, 2017

Easily could mix an album with any one of a number of channel strips excluding any time based needs. But the beauty of ITB mixing is that you aren't limited to one console. So I won't!

Serenity · May 21, 2017

Yeah, there's a difference between could and would. When someone says that they could mix a whole album using just a certain channel strip it only means that it is good and versatile enough to do the job, but that doesn't mean that it's the ideal solution.

Personally I try to keep things simple. I generally use channel strips as the base and try to do most of the work with that, then add other plugins when it's called for. For some mixes I do fine with just a certain channel strip, sometimes I need to add an LA-2A, 1176 and Pultec in a couple of places, sometimes I feel the need to add a sh*tload of different plugins.
It depends a lot on how well recorded the tracks are and if I want to keep it natural or take it in a completely different direction.

I recently did a mix with just the new SSL strip, some reverb and delay and I was completely satisfied with that. Didn't feel the need for any other plugins. Granted, the vocals worked well with the SSL compressor, which I often find not to be the case.

But yeah, I don't feel the need for a large variety of plugins. And I honestly have more than I really need.

woodyreed · May 21, 2017

From a GUI perspetive, I'd loose my mind if I had to mix an entire project with just a channel strip. Good Lord! Nothing but those tiny little virtual knobs requiring micro moves to set right would make me loose it if it's all I had.

Eric Dahlberg · May 22, 2017

calimike said:
Lots of wisdom in Albini's description of an SSL console, that the more modules you engage, the worse it sounds.

Perhaps with some 4000's, certainly not with 9000's, which mostly sound like straight wire. Also, Mark "Spike" Stent and Chris Lord Alge would disagree with that statement.

jonschmitz said:
Easily could mix an album with any one of a number of channel strips excluding any time based needs. But the beauty of ITB mixing is that you aren't limited to one console. So I won't!

It's great for new users. I'd have no problem telling a new user to just get the SSL MK2, API Vision, or Neve 88RS MK2, nothing else. They can even get a decent channel count with the Vision.

mpayne0 · May 22, 2017

Whenever I've tried to do channel strip mixes, I always seem to break my own rules on the drums and bass. The compressors are not as flexible as others that I have.

It definitely is a faster workflow, I think I tend to listen more carefully to what I have rather than wondering what else I could use.

mpayne0 · May 22, 2017

woodyreed said:
From a GUI perspetive, I'd loose my mind if I had to mix an entire project with just a channel strip. Good Lord! Nothing but those tiny little virtual knobs requiring micro moves to set right would make me loose it if it's all I had.

haha also true, but in a way this forces me to tinker less, and make chunkier, braver moves.

One thing I should have done was set up the knobs and faders on my midi KB to work with the strips.

mpayne0 · May 22, 2017

sorry! DP

De Pepper · May 22, 2017

calimike said:
Oh I thought this was gonna be about how channel strips generally don't sound good, and asking if using them would kill the benefits of other plugins like Studer, 1176, etc. To that, I'd say maybe.

Well no, I'm rather assuming all the strips sound really great in each their own, coloured way.

So are you saying that even if including e.g. tape machines and special processing (e.g. CV, SPL TD) you'd say yes, maybe the channel strips render all the other plugins more or less un-benefitial?

Serenity said:
Yeah, there's a difference between could and would.

[..]

Personally I try to keep things simple. I generally use channel strips as the base and try to do most of the work with that, then add other plugins when it's called for.

[..]

But yeah, I don't feel the need for a large variety of plugins. And I honestly have more than I really need.

Interesting, this is at the heart of my question.

Basically I feel this f#cked up urge to acquire the 88RS or the SSL to get great sound and speed up my workflow. But I'm very reluctant because:

1) Maybe I'd use them so much that all my other UA-purchases will be irrelevant

or

2) Maybe I won't use them enough because I'll keep adding 1176's, 2A's, 670's, 1073's, Trident's, Pultec's etc. because I own and like them.

- thus reducing the strip to a pre, a filter and a gate! Or worse, only a pre and a gate because I have great filters already.

I find both scenarios kinda horrific

But maybe it's because I don't realize the power of the strips or can't fully picture the channel strip + ad hoc plugins workflow.

Hm, to buy or not to buy and why, that is the perennial question.

mpayne0 · May 22, 2017

De Pepper said:
Interesting, this is at the heart of my question.

Basically I feel this f#cked up urge to acquire the 88RS or the SSL to get great sound and speed up my workflow. But I'm very reluctant because:

1) Maybe I'd use them so much that all my other UA-purchases will be irrelevant

or

2) Maybe I won't use them enough because I'll keep adding 1176's, 2A's, 670's, 1073's, Trident's, Pultec's etc. because I own and like them.

- thus reducing the strip to a pre, a filter and a gate! Or worse, only a pre and a gate because I have great filters already.

I find both scenarios kinda horrific But maybe it's because I don't realize the power of the strips or can't fully picture the channel strip + ad hoc plugins workflow.

Hm, to buy or not to buy and why, that is the perennial question.

1.) Can't you say that about any new comp you buy?

2.) If you like the sound, you'll probably use them enough. There is something about the SSL eq that is hard to get anywhere else.

Beechwood · May 22, 2017

De Pepper said:
Basically I feel this f#cked up urge to acquire the 88RS or the SSL to get great sound and speed up my workflow. But I'm very reluctant because:

1) Maybe I'd use them so much that all my other UA-purchases will be irrelevant

or

2) Maybe I won't use them enough because I'll keep adding 1176's, 2A's, 670's, 1073's, Trident's, Pultec's etc. because I own and like them.

I really love the channel strip workflow, so I'm sorry if I go on a bit. I find you can really go over the top when mixing, torturing yourself and your mix by going into massive depth on every source. So often you can EQ or compress something that doesn't really need anything other than maybe some filtering. And when you do need something, it's making the right adjustment that's most important, not which processor you use. As satisfying as it is to use all the fancy plugins we have, you don't get any bonus points for using a fairchild on a shaker. Using 1176s and 1073s on everything can make things sound a bit overdone when I've tried it. The strips have everything you need right there and are transparent enough to use everywhere. I save the special plugs for special tracks and for busses.

That's been my experience anyway. So I find channel strips helpful.

When you do try to use one channel strip for everything you soon discover the situations where you need something else... it's exactly like having a great desk and a rack of outboard gear. The compressor on the 88RS is very good and works on nearly everything, but it doesn't have much character, and isn't punchy like the SSL channel compressor. So I'd sometimes use an SSL comp instead, or a dbx160, or whatever else. I've only demo'd the UAD SSL strip (although I have the IK version) but the main issue I had with that was that the EQ doesn't go as low and high as I'd like sometimes. So I'd use the 88RS EQ, or some other 'outboard' EQ. Maybe they'll do the G series strip in the future to address that. I don't love the API strip, the EQ just seems unsatisfying in the highs and lows, and I don't really get on with the compressor. But again, you add in other gear as you feel you need it. That's kind of the point.

Personally I think if I was trying to use one strip on everything, the SSL would be the one as the compressor has 'punch mode' and 'smash mode' (slow and fast attack) and the filters are very adjustable (2 slopes and a wide range). But if you want to be able to use other stuff a lot anyway, the 88RS is fine. The 88RS EQ is a better general purpose EQ IMO. Or you might love the Vision, and the DSP is much less.

In short, do it! You actually start to think more carefully about what's unique about each plugin, so you might even use stuff better.

De Pepper · May 22, 2017

mpayne0 said:
1.) Can't you say that about any new comp you buy?

2.) If you like the sound, you'll probably use them enough. There is something about the SSL eq that is hard to get anywhere else.

Ha, indeed

- except the LA-3A and the Vari MU don't compete for insert slots.

You are probably right.

- and I'm very curious to try it out. I'm on OSX 10.9.5 though so I guess I'm not yet UA v9.2 compatible ...

Serenity · May 22, 2017

De Pepper said:
Interesting, this is at the heart of my question.

Basically I feel this f#cked up urge to acquire the 88RS or the SSL to get great sound and speed up my workflow. But I'm very reluctant because:

1) Maybe I'd use them so much that all my other UA-purchases will be irrelevant

or

2) Maybe I won't use them enough because I'll keep adding 1176's, 2A's, 670's, 1073's, Trident's, Pultec's etc. because I own and like them.
- thus reducing the strip to a pre, a filter and a gate!

Except for wasting a bit of money on unused plugins there's no downside to finding a better way to reach your goal right?
Though I have to say that despite not using some plugins on a regular basis there are not that many I regret buying. The ones I do regret are those I bought because I was too influenced of what other people thought of them and didn't follow my own taste in the end.

I think channel strips for in the box mixing has two main advantages. It can force you to limit your choices, which may allow you to work faster and don't waste time trying to decide which EQ or compressor to pick for the track (or even worse A/B/C/D/E/F-comparing them). Of course, this can be achieved by simply restraining yourself to use a certain set of plugins if you have that level of self control.
And of course the ease of just loading one instance of a plugin and have everything within reach is a big advantage to me. That's also why the Console 1 has been such a success.

ThomasM · May 22, 2017

Serenity said:
That's also why the Console 1 has been such a success.

It's been a huge success for my workflow at least. My base is almost always the SSL 4K strip, on some channels/buses I exchange stuff (to UAD parts or British Channel parts) and go on. The beauty of having the controls right there under my fingertips on every channel is just so, how can I describe it, "immediate". On some channels only the filters are used, on some only the compressor or the EQ but on ALL the distorsion is used, mostly moderately

De Pepper · May 22, 2017

Beechwood said:
[..] it's making the right adjustment that's most important, not which processor you use.

True! - at least I'm learning this.

Beechwood said:
As satisfying as it is to use all the fancy plugins we have, you don't get any bonus points for using a fairchild on a shaker.

Dammit! How about maracas?

Beechwood said:
I save the special plugs for special tracks and for busses.

Nice! - I can vividly see that work for me.

Beechwood said:
When you do try to use one channel strip for everything you soon discover the situations where you need something else...

Impatient to get there!

Beechwood said:
In short, do it! You actually start to think more carefully about what's unique about each plugin, so you might even use stuff better.

That is indeed a worthy end goal.

Thanks for going on a bit

MikeGS · May 22, 2017

Serenity said:
Except for wasting a bit of money on unused plugins there's no downside to finding a better way to reach your goal right?
Though I have to say that despite not using some plugins on a regular basis there are not that many I regret buying. The ones I do regret are those I bought because I was too influenced of what other people thought of them and didn't follow my own taste in the end.

I think channel strips for in the box mixing has two main advantages. It can force you to limit your choices, which may allow you to work faster and don't waste time trying to decide which EQ or compressor to pick for the track (or even worse A/B/C/D/E/F-comparing them). Of course, this can be achieved by simply restraining yourself to use a certain set of plugins if you have that level of self control.
And of course the ease of just loading one instance of a plugin and have everything within reach is a big advantage to me. That's also why the Console 1 has been such a success.

Exactly this with Console 1. Using the 4K channel strip mostly, I can quickly start to work my way through a mix, just using the strip, but I instinctively know when I need a different EQ or compressor.... typically drums bass and vocals. To be honest now I have such a large collection of plugins I can't use them all on every mix. But I'd rather spend time getting mixes done, than trying EQ or compressor A, B, C, etc.

DanButsu · May 22, 2017

I wish we could do this with uad, but to have a console strip on every channel we'd need 4x octos. Working with freeze track is very disruptive and negates the purpose of a console workflow and the possibility of mixing in context, in realtime.

Been looking at Console 1 as an alternative!

Serenity · May 22, 2017

DanButsu said:
I wish we could do this with uad, but to have a console strip on every channel we'd need 4x octos. Working with freeze track is very disruptive and negates the purpose of a console workflow and the possibility of mixing in context, in realtime.

Been looking at Console 1 as an alternative!

I find that it's actually not that bad. It depends on usage and amount of tracks of course. A lot of times the EQ stays disengaged on many channels for me so the DSP usage is not that bad.
But I wish so badly that Softube would implement support for UAD strips in Console 1. It would make it perfect for me. I love the workflow, but knowing how much better (to my taste) it could sound with the UAD SSL MkII is a bit disturbing. Lately I've been finding myself replacing the C1 with the UAD SSL on a lot of tracks when I'm close to done with the mix for that reason. And it's not exactly a time-saver

De Pepper · May 22, 2017

Serenity said:
Except for wasting a bit of money on unused plugins there's no downside to finding a better way to reach your goal right?

Click to expand...

You're right, no downside. On the flipside I count pennies these days so please cease the Console1 talk everyone

Though I have to say that despite not using some plugins on a regular basis there are not that many I regret buying. The ones I do regret are those I bought because I was too influenced of what other people thought of them and didn't follow my own taste in the end.

Click to expand...

Well, dammit, edit that pennie-thing: I just lit up the bx_console for USD61.25. I hope I'll like it as much as those other people who like it :roll: it's no UA strip, but despite the sale the 88RS was still out of my range this time anyway.

I think channel strips for in the box mixing has two main advantages. It can force you to limit your choices, which may allow you to work faster and don't waste time trying to decide which EQ or compressor to pick for the track (or even worse A/B/C/D/E/F-comparing them). Of course, this can be achieved by simply restraining yourself to use a certain set of plugins if you have that level of self control. And of course the ease of just loading one instance of a plugin and have everything within reach is a big advantage to me. That's also why the Console 1 has been such a success.

Click to expand...

Again, I really dig the choice-limiting aspect. And the DSP-cap since I just went native with the bx. That'll be saved for the busses and master like Beechwood said.

Channel strips - do they kill other plugins?

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