Delay ducking.....Vocals suggestions

[killa]

I would like to know what you other guys use for delay on vocals especially. I am specifically looking for delay ducking rather than having it all over my lead vox. Right now I am copying and pasting lines to repeat after the end of a line but it takes so long and I'd rather a plugin that can do it.

BTW I use Nuendo 2 and I have 2 UAD cards.

 

[neil wilkes]

PSP 42 Lexicon delay line is great.
Also, the delay lines with the UAD cards are pretty good too.

As for ducking in & out, why not automate it with Nuendo??
Much easier than copy/paste

 

[killa]

I want a solution that is built into the plugin, and so far, I can't find any. I thought it was fairly popular effect, but I can't seem to find a plugin that does it.

 

[handojin]

how would a plugin know when you want the delay on or off? unless your talking about a gated delay.. which is very easy to acheive... the dynamics plugin included with nuendo has a gate that is frequency dependant which is great for that aswell, for me if i want gated delay (delay on after hitting a certain threshold) i use dynamic plugin... otherwise if i want delay on certain words or syllables i either use the method neil is talking about ( which is not a chore... it is extrememly easy and fast) or i use a seperate track... snip out the parts i want delay on and drag them down.. all of these methods are quick and painless.. no need to automate anything...
hope im understanding you correct

 

[killa]

Actually what delay ducking is, and what I'd like to do, is only have the delay engage when there is space between words. You should be able to set the sensitivity to how fast it reacts, that way the delay only starts on the ends of lines rather than all over the place.

 

[Rankus]

Actually what delay ducking is, and what I'd like to do, is only have the delay engage when there is space between words. You should be able to set the sensitivity to how fast it reacts, that way the delay only starts on the ends of lines rather than all over the place.

Great Idea!

 

[UniversalAudio-Joe]

Here's something you can try:
1) Create a *stereo* group and feed it your *mono* vocal.
2) On the group, insert the Leveler plug, followed by a *mono* delay, then a *stereo* gate, and finally another Leveler. The DM-1L(m) and GateComp can be used for the delay and gate.
3) On the first Leveler, set the left channel lower than the right (try -12dB), and on the second Leveler, mute the right (dry) channel.
4) Set the gate's threshold so it opens only when the louder right-channel dry vocal is present, but not the left-channel delay.
5) Send this group to a second Mono group or insert a stereo panner to pan the gated delay back to center.

The idea is to use the dry vocal to trigger a gate on the delay.

Another way to do this is to use a gate with a key input on one channel.

 

[handojin]

Actually what delay ducking is, and what I'd like to do, is only have the delay engage when there is space between words. You should be able to set the sensitivity to how fast it reacts, that way the delay only starts on the ends of lines rather than all over the place.

now i understand you... that makes a lot more sense to read.
however.. couple things to keep in mind

1; if a plugin where to do this it would need a look ahead feature.. no biggie meaning it would be ideal only in the mixing stage and not tracking... i personally think a plugin like this would be more ideal if it where used in the tracking stage (see number 2 for reasoning)

2 if you where to use a plugin like this it would catch the last end of the word and not always know how long that word or sylable was held for..
so even if they implemented a speed to kick in at.. you would have to adjust that at the end of every phrase to make sure it gets the right part you want delayed... ie... last word of phase sang is universal... the plugin might catch the "sal" very last bit of the vocal... universal sal sal sal sal for example... you might want it to be universal versal versal versal ect...
or idealy universal universal universal universal ect

what im getting at is as smart as the plugin could be it wouldnt know what you wanted for the delay... and when i do this by editing it manually... i get maximum control of what i want delayed...every phaze is different.. and is probably going to end with a different word.. sylable or such..
you really have to listen to that last bit... make your desicion and go from there.... unless your happy with selecting an amount of time to delay before the silenced part..


sorry if i am unclear trying to explain this..

when it really comes down to this.. yes a plugin could do this... but
the way i do it and the way Tom mentioned it is better.. more flexible and not that time consuming.. using a midi gate trigered from a keyboard or foot controller would be ideal to for speed.. if you use cubase or nuendo and use "in place edit" so you can see it against the audio would be my prefered choice.

i cant think of any at the moment but on many ocasions when i delay the last sylable of a longer word it starts to sound like a completely different word aswell... something like " listen to my album bum bum bum bum"
you dont want to call your audience bums do you?
jk
sometimes catching the delay between sylables sounds really neat to...
for study material you should check out some dub artist..
dub side of the moon for instance

 

[Akis]

handojin, that's not how ducking delay works.

The delay works all the time. The actual difference from a conventional delay plug/unit is that you can set an attenuation value and a threshold. When your audio signal is above the threshold, the delay output is attenuated by the value set. When the signal drops below the threshold, the delay output rises back to its full value. How fast it will rise back depends on the release setting. Anyway, no chopped words etc. occur.

I hope this is clear.

See also here the ducker section of the Rocktron Intellifex manual.

 

[killa]

I am a guitar player as well and that is where I heard of it first, years ago. I just would like to apply it to vocals....Thanks for all the ideas.

 

[handojin]

thanks for the clear up akis
now i fully understand

i still however wouldnt use an effect or plugin like that since i like using it my way.. feels more clean and controlled to me.. i might experiment next time however

 

[paulwheatley1]

I think \"Morphing Delay\" from NuSofting does what you want.
Take a look at: http://nusofting.liqihsynth.com/

 

[killa]

Looks great, I'll get the demo...Thanks.

 

[Dave Bourke]

Actually, it looks like nobody spotted the excellent suggestion by Joe Bryan (you know, Universal Audio's VP of Engineering and Technology) a few posts back in this thread.

That one's gone straight into my tips & tricks database. Thank you, Joe.

Kind regards.

 

[killa]

I did read it however using 4 plugins to do a simple task is not what I had in mind. I will give it a try tomorrow.

 

[Dave Bourke]

The Korg Wavestation effects (another Joe Bryan triumph) provide a modulator called Key-down Gate. If you assign a delay, when you stop playing on your controller keyboard, the delay is immediately boosted or attenuated, depending on how you set it.

Now, if you could figure out how to replicate this for a vocal track you'd be laughing...



Kind regards.