fairchild as a master buss compressor

[grame]

hi chaps

am about to do a 'home' master of my new album and wanted some advice on using the fairchild as a master buss compressor to slightly glue and warm the mix - trouble is the thing looks so goddamn complicated. could someone post the appropriate settings as the presets are maddeningly vague. i may switch on the demo of the neve as this was what was used on my last album.

cheers

 

[saemskin]

It's not that bad, just read the manual for it and it explains the settings and what they do.
Have you used it for this purpose yet? I've noticed that it adds alot of low end junk.

 

[grame]

i find the interface a little forbidding. those little knobs in the bottom left hand corner totally changed the sound. i want a nice vintage sound if possible.

 

[Kev]

Read this: http://www.chrismilne.com/uadforums/vie ... php?t=7769
Good setting to start with and tweak from there.
Don't forget to use your ears. 8)

 

[grame]

thanks for very much for both replies - i never knew about the manual. turns out i've been using the pultec wrongly for the past year! i think i'll see which sounds best between the fairchild and the neve. the guy who mastered my last album said he usually preferred not to compress if he could help it. but the producer ran the final mixes through a special neve compressor which i assume is the one modelled in the UAD. i guess the best thing is to keep copies of each track with buss compression and without and let the mastering people choose.

 

[Shadowing]

you shouldnt even be using compression or limiter on your out channel of your mixer if you are going to send it off to be master

 

[Plec]

you shouldnt even be using compression or limiter on your out channel of your mixer if you are going to send it off to be master

How do you come to that conclusion?

 

[Suntower]

you shouldnt even be using compression or limiter on your out channel of your mixer if you are going to send it off to be master

Why not?

The only things I would recommend are

1. Tell your ME about it. My ME spanked me savagely the first time I submitted a song with Fairchild across the buss, simply because he wasn't expecting it... it was a new kind of sound for me.

But once he/she knows what you're going for, he can make his adjustments to work WITH it and not try to compensate for it.

2. Mix through the buss comp from the start. Don't just strap it on at the end of the mix process.

---JC

 

[sniper]

What's the difference between compressing all your stems (individually) and compressing your master bus? I mean from a mastering engineer's point of view.

Do mastering engineers REALLY expect a mix with maybe a compressor on vocals and bass and the rest untouched?!

I'm willing to bet everything i have that Jeff Lynne's sound isn't based on the creative mind of a mastering engineer...
I know i've said it before but it has to be said again:
a compressed sound might just be a s o u n d!

 

[imdrecordings]

You guys give compressors to much credit.... :wink:

 

[MASSIVE Mastering]

2. Mix through the buss comp from the start. Don't just strap it on at the end of the mix process.

Key. That is key.

 

[Shadowing]

First you need to understand what your wanting to do with compression.
As to why your wanting to use it on the track in the first place.

read the link below, your guide to all

tweakheadz . com/guide.htm

 

[Chi-Squared Mastering]

What's the difference between compressing all your stems (individually) and compressing your master bus? I mean from a mastering engineer's point of view.

MEs work on the complete mix. A compressor on your drum bus won't affect your vocals, but a compressor on your main outs will affect and be affected by everything. 2dB compression on each channel sounds different from 2dB compression on the main bus only, even though the loudest instrument may still be compressed by the same amount. Not always better or worse, of course. But very different.

Do mastering engineers REALLY expect a mix with maybe a compressor on vocals and bass and the rest untouched?!

I doubt it. Mixers compress. People like to say "Don't put a THING on your master bus!" but I don't know how many of those same people expect to receive songs without any master EQ or compression. More like, "If I tell him to use NONE, then he won't overdo it."

I know i've said it before but it has to be said again:
a compressed sound might just be a s o u n d!

Absolutely. There's nothing wrong with doing what you need to do during recording and mixing to get the sound you want. The problem comes when the mixer decides his song doesn't sound as loud as his favorite CD. Of course it doesn't, it's not supposed to at that point in its life cycle.

That's like beating eggs, adding sugar, adding chocolate, adding flour, then wondering why your batter doesn't taste like your favorite cookie. It's not done yet, why should it? Make the best batter you can make, and with careful baking you'll get the best cookies. Neither batter nor oven alone can do it.

 

[Shadowing]

The reason your not suppose to put anything on your mixdown channel is because all that can be done from who ever is mastering the song.

Plus , eq's and compression will work better on a sterio mixdown. I dont know why lol but it just does.

I tested this out. \"To my ear\" My UAd compressors work way beter mastering a song that is already mixdown then just sticking compressors and equalizers at the end channel

 

[XAXAU]

i guess mixing with a comp on the 2 bus from the start and then taking it off before sending it mastering would be good. unless you know exactly what levels you should have to not upset the ME´s comp?

 

[MASSIVE Mastering]

Plus , eq's and compression will work better on a sterio mixdown. I dont know why lol but it just does.

I tested this out. "To my ear" My UAd compressors work way beter mastering a song that is already mixdown then just sticking compressors and equalizers at the end channel

That doesn't make any sense... Compressing / EQ'ing a buss, the main buss, and aux send, a group, whatever - is going to be a totally different process than EQ'ing a single source. It's not an "interchangeable" thing... One isn't going to be "better" -- One is going to be one way and the other is not. I'm not going to add an EQ to the drum buss if I just want a little less sizzle in the hat. I'm not going to compress a drum buss if I want a little less dynamic range on the toms.

 

[XAXAU]

exactly. thats why MEs never touch any knobs. they just tell the mixing engineers what to do :lol:

 

[Shadowing]

Ahh no thats not what I was trying to say lol

I was saying if you are going to master it. Then you should mix it down first then master it.

I was saying it seems like UAD compressors works better when you master a mxdown song instead of sticking the compressor on your Main bus.

anyways, XAXAU I dont think you should put anything on your Main buss while mixing.

If you add a compressor on your Main bus while mixing you wont beable to add the correct amount of compressoion on your indivual tracks.

Same with eq's. Not to mention it would be extremly hard to get the front to back ratio of your instruments in your mix.

while your mixing its not suppose to be loud like you hear cd's on the radio. Thats the whole point of mastering and if you try to master while mixing you will be just running in circles.

 

[imdrecordings]

I say Master while you Mix, if you can.

It's the only way.....

... if you plan on \"Mastering\" it yourself.

Why throw away all that control?

 

[Plec]

Ahh no thats not what I was trying to say lol

I was saying if you are going to master it. Then you should mix it down first then master it.

I was saying it seems like UAD compressors works better when you master a mxdown song instead of sticking the compressor on your Main bus.

I don't think you realize that it's the exact same thing, just like MM tried to explain. There is no technical difference whatsoever between those two scenarios.

anyways, XAXAU I dont think you should put anything on your Main buss while mixing.

If you add a compressor on your Main bus while mixing you wont beable to add the correct amount of compressoion on your indivual tracks.

Same with eq's. Not to mention it would be extremly hard to get the front to back ratio of your instruments in your mix.

Well, everyone has their own way of working but to me it seems like you never gave it a shot using the right kind of gear for the job. Maybe it's not appropriate for the stuff you do, but most mix sessions I've done and been involved in on commercial and more aggressive styles, use mix-bus processing as an integral part of the sound. In most cases it's a very big artistic decision that is hard to trust to a mastering engineer that you've had no previous comunication with. You should always send stuff out that you're happy with. You can't expect the mastering engineer to "fix" things for you. I don't know how many times I've heard "just wait 'til it's mastered". That's a load of BS commonly heard from inexperienced engineers and producers i.e they don't know what's wrong, so they trust someone else will be able to fix it for them.

while your mixing its not suppose to be loud like you hear cd's on the radio. Thats the whole point of mastering and if you try to master while mixing you will be just running in circles.

No, totally disagree...
If you want to be competitive in loudness, you need to mix with loudness in mind. Going for a certain amount of loudness when mixing is only healthy since you will notice much faster how a mix will hold up in mastering when pushed hard. In most cases, a great mastering studio will be able to push your material 2-3db more than you could ever achieve at a typical mix session, but if you're going for something commercially loud, and you can only get the mix up to -12 > -11db RMS using standard limiters and whatnot before things start to sound akward, you don't have very loudness friendly material to being with, so a mastering studio will not be able to make that much more loud either since the mix probably is unbalanced. Of course you should send your mixes "un-limited" to the mastering studio, or just use small amounts of it if it constitutes a better musical result in your opinion. But it's always a good thing to see how loud you are able to push it at the mixstage.