-
Welcome to the General Discussion forum for UAD users! Please note that this forum is user-run, although we're thrilled to have so much contribution from Drew, Will, and other UA folks! Feel free to discuss both UAD and non-UAD related subjects! 1) Please do not post technical issues here. Please use our UAD Support Forums instead. 2) Please do not post complaints here. Use the Unrest Forum instead. They have no place in the the General Discussion forum. Threads posted in the wrong forum will be moved, so if you don't see your thread here anymore, please look in the correct forum. Lastly, please be respectful.
Good use of Neve 1073 EQ for Zakk Wylde Guitars?
- Thread starter keano
- Start date
Actually the 1073 can work miracles on heavier guitarsounds. The lows and mids sounds stellar on most heavy stuff. Can't tell you exactly how to go about it though... but just try to get rid of a bit high-end sizzle by cutting with the high-shelf a tad. Then try boosting at 3.2K and then boost at 60 or 110Hz with the lows. If you have very dynamic lows to begin with.. which happens with most 4x12\".. be sure to use a multiband before the EQ to fix this.
NuSkoolTone
Established Member
Forgive me, but doesn't the Kick and Bass usually live in the 60-110hz range?Plec said:Actually the 1073 can work miracles on heavier guitarsounds. The lows and mids sounds stellar on most heavy stuff. Can't tell you exactly how to go about it though... but just try to get rid of a bit high-end sizzle by cutting with the high-shelf a tad. Then try boosting at 3.2K and then boost at 60 or 110Hz with the lows. If you have very dynamic lows to begin with.. which happens with most 4x12".. be sure to use a multiband before the EQ to fix this.
I'd have to be working on quite a spare mix to be boosting down there on guitars IME... I'd say to Focus on the Mids. Between 200-1.6k is where the action is on guitars IMO. Then adjust treble to taste.
NuSkoolTone
Established Member
Hmm 220hz I could see. 110hz if the recorded guitar was weak perhaps. I can't see how this wouldn't eat into the bass unless the bass was mimicing the guitar line exactly. But hey I'm just a project studio guy, and my bag of tricks probably isn't as full.keano said:Zakks engineer says:
But on the dirty guitars I ran both mics through the 1073s with a touch of top end boost and a lot of bottom boost (220Hz/110Hz).
keano:
I can understand Zakks engineer. If it's the JCM800 with somekind of overdrive setup right? It produces quite a balanced non-sizzly high-end to start with.. so a small boost with the 1073 would probably sound just right there. With more \"modern\" sounds like Mesa's and Peavey's etc.. it's more common to remove some of the very high-end sizzle to make room for the hihat and cymbals and attack of the other instruments. Multiband compression is standard in most heavy-guitar engineering you hear today. Modern setups usually have a very dynamic low-end action. The Peavey JSX is some of the most extreme and the Mesa Rectifier is some of the most controlled. Anywho... depending on the amp and cabinet you're using you will have a varying degree of dynamic action happening at 90-150Hz for the most part. Depending on the production.. this dynamic low-end will make your kick and other bass instruments sound like crap and it will also muddy up the rest of the mix. Compressing this area of frequencies is what you do to fix that problem. How much depends on the production of course. Total limiting will make the guitars sound small and lacking power and not doing anything there will make it sound congested and out of control. You just have to find the right balance there.
NuSkoolTone:
You're right... but you have to know how the shelving curves work to understand the logic of boosting at 60-110Hz. Even while boosting at 60Hz with the 1073 you have a shelf that starts somewhere around 200Hz or something (I know the frequency is wrong.. but something like that). The shelf starts there and slowly builds up to 60Hz which gives you a boost all the way from 20Hz to 200Hz or so. Setting it at 110Hz might start the shelf at 300Hz or so.
Basically.. you're not boosting just the 60Hz frequency. You're affecting a lot more than that. And since guitars don't live down there.. and you've probably high-passed all the junk below 60Hz.. you don't get much effect at 60Hz.. you just gain the fatness and character of the filter itself.
I can understand Zakks engineer. If it's the JCM800 with somekind of overdrive setup right? It produces quite a balanced non-sizzly high-end to start with.. so a small boost with the 1073 would probably sound just right there. With more \"modern\" sounds like Mesa's and Peavey's etc.. it's more common to remove some of the very high-end sizzle to make room for the hihat and cymbals and attack of the other instruments. Multiband compression is standard in most heavy-guitar engineering you hear today. Modern setups usually have a very dynamic low-end action. The Peavey JSX is some of the most extreme and the Mesa Rectifier is some of the most controlled. Anywho... depending on the amp and cabinet you're using you will have a varying degree of dynamic action happening at 90-150Hz for the most part. Depending on the production.. this dynamic low-end will make your kick and other bass instruments sound like crap and it will also muddy up the rest of the mix. Compressing this area of frequencies is what you do to fix that problem. How much depends on the production of course. Total limiting will make the guitars sound small and lacking power and not doing anything there will make it sound congested and out of control. You just have to find the right balance there.
NuSkoolTone:
You're right... but you have to know how the shelving curves work to understand the logic of boosting at 60-110Hz. Even while boosting at 60Hz with the 1073 you have a shelf that starts somewhere around 200Hz or something (I know the frequency is wrong.. but something like that). The shelf starts there and slowly builds up to 60Hz which gives you a boost all the way from 20Hz to 200Hz or so. Setting it at 110Hz might start the shelf at 300Hz or so.
Basically.. you're not boosting just the 60Hz frequency. You're affecting a lot more than that. And since guitars don't live down there.. and you've probably high-passed all the junk below 60Hz.. you don't get much effect at 60Hz.. you just gain the fatness and character of the filter itself.
As you will discover with all sound engineering... First, fix what's wrong and THEN enhance the sound.keano said:Thanks Plec. so your saying to compress the low end of my guitars (I use same set up Marshall JCM800, LP and EMG, with OD, 4X12 cab) rather then just boost or let them be then? Makes sense.
For example.. let's say you have a too dull vocal but with heavy "s" sounds. If you first EQ that and slap on a DeEsser.. the DeEsser will fight the EQ. If you first use the DeEsser and "fix the problem before you enhance" and THEN use the same EQ boost, you will end up with a MUCH more pleasing result. Same thing with guitars. Try experimenting with multiband compression around that area of 90-150Hz.. I think that the JCM 800 will sound a lot more balanced in the low-end than most modern amps.. so you might not have to do anything.. or use it very sparingly. However... after you've compressed the lows to keep them in check.. I've found the 1073 to sound huge when boosting a bit of low end on heavy guitars now that the low-end itself is under control.
Which track? Depending on the album, it does matter.keano said:Zakks engineer says:
But on the dirty guitars I ran both mics through the 1073s with a touch of top end boost and a lot of bottom boost (220Hz/110Hz).
NuSkoolTone
Established Member
Plec said:NuSkoolTone:
You're right... but you have to know how the shelving curves work to understand the logic of boosting at 60-110Hz. Even while boosting at 60Hz with the 1073 you have a shelf that starts somewhere around 200Hz or something (I know the frequency is wrong.. but something like that). The shelf starts there and slowly builds up to 60Hz which gives you a boost all the way from 20Hz to 200Hz or so. Setting it at 110Hz might start the shelf at 300Hz or so.
Basically.. you're not boosting just the 60Hz frequency. You're affecting a lot more than that. And since guitars don't live down there.. and you've probably high-passed all the junk below 60Hz.. you don't get much effect at 60Hz.. you just gain the fatness and character of the filter itself.
Ah I use that "trick" all the time. There was no mention of a HP being used so I took it literally.