Question about the effect of sample rate on DSP resources

[Mattingleymike]

Hi all
We're a bit new to the Apollo system and using Windows and Console. What sample rate do people generally work at and what effect does it have on the number of plugins available on inserts? We're seeing a lot of DSP Exceeded messages with only C-Vox being used on the chain with a reverb while tracking vocals.
Using an X6 Twin X quad combination at 96 KHz sample rate. I think the tutorial videos seem to only use 48 or 44.1 KHz so would dropping down allow more plugins for real time monitoring.
Appreciate any advice
Cheers

 

[Matt Hepworth]

Hi all
We're a bit new to the Apollo system and using Windows and Console. What sample rate do people generally work at and what effect does it have on the number of plugins available on inserts? We're seeing a lot of DSP Exceeded messages with only C-Vox being used on the chain with a reverb while tracking vocals.
Using an X6 Twin X quad combination at 96 KHz sample rate. I think the tutorial videos seem to only use 48 or 44.1 KHz so would dropping down allow more plugins for real time monitoring.
Appreciate any advice
Cheers

Hi, check my link at the top of the forum under Resources. I have a comparison chart. 48kHz is a work in progress.

 

[Mattingleymike]

Thanks, Matt. If I read your data correctly, the impact of increasing to 96 kHz sampling isn't that massive on the DSP resources needed - only a few percentage points in most cases. Is that right?
Cheers
Mike

 

[UniversalAudio]

Thanks, Matt. If I read your data correctly, the impact of increasing to 96 kHz sampling isn't that massive on the DSP resources needed - only a few percentage points in most cases. Is that right?
Cheers
Mike

Correct, because many use internal upsampling.

 

[Mattingleymike]

Is this DSP allocation malarky the type of thing Luna takes care of?

 

[LesBrown]

Is this DSP allocation malarky the type of thing Luna takes care of?

More like the Apollo. It works in DAWs beside Luna, too.

 

[c3r1c]

Hi all
We're a bit new to the Apollo system and using Windows and Console. What sample rate do people generally work at and what effect does it have on the number of plugins available on inserts? We're seeing a lot of DSP Exceeded messages with only C-Vox being used on the chain with a reverb while tracking vocals.
Using an X6 Twin X quad combination at 96 KHz sample rate. I think the tutorial videos seem to only use 48 or 44.1 KHz so would dropping down allow more plugins for real time monitoring.
Appreciate any advice
Cheers

You might get more mileage from your interface putting the reverb on an Aux in Console.

Also have you turned on DSP sharing to help with high-DSP-usage signal chains?

Lastly, if you haven't watched the UA videos on YouTube (or read the UA manuals) you'll gain a lot of useful/insightful info about the platform and not only its limitations, but also some good workarounds when you run into those limitations.

 

[Mattingleymike]

You might get more mileage from your interface putting the reverb on an Aux in Console.

Also have you turned on DSP sharing to help with high-DSP-usage signal chains?

Lastly, if you haven't watched the UA videos on YouTube (or read the UA manuals) you'll gain a lot of useful/insightful info about the platform and not only its limitations, but also some good workarounds when you run into those limitations.

Thanks for that. I've made some progress along those lines but it's a steep learning curve for a novice. I think I'm getting there but not having a background in recording makes the curve steeper but ultimately sweeter!
I've watched a lot of the UA tutorials but without wishing to open a can of worms there's quite an emphasis on Luna which leaves us windows users a bit lonely!

 

[Matt Hepworth]

Thanks for that. I've made some progress along those lines but it's a steep learning curve for a novice. I think I'm getting there but not having a background in recording makes the curve steeper but ultimately sweeter!
I've watched a lot of the UA tutorials but without wishing to open a can of worms there's quite an emphasis on Luna which leaves us windows users a bit lonely!

I do a few videos on PT and Studio One on my mostly UA focused channel. Link in signature.

 

[Mattingleymike]

Thanks Matt. I've already subscribed to your channel and found it amazingly useful with some of the fiendishly clever routing tricks. My son uses Ableton for EDM but I think we'll try PT as the free intro version has enough for simple tracking.
The curve gets ever longer...
Really appreciate the advice

 

[Matt Hepworth]

I've already subscribed to your channel and found it amazingly useful with some of the fiendishly clever routing tricks.

Thank you! Love the word choice, too!

 

[Mattingleymike]

Thank you! Love the word choice, too!

Don't you ever sleep?

 

[c3r1c]

You'll have to go much farther back than UA's recent stuff on their YouTube channel. This is because the Apollo platform is mature, stable and has been thoroughly documented for some time, whereas LUNA is the new hotness, which means the more recent videos will be about that.

Some recommended videos on getting started with Console and the Apollos:

If you have any questions, always feel free to ask. There are no stupid questions, especially at the beginning on your journey.

As to DAWs, we have a number of people here who work in different DAWs, so if you have any questions about particular DAW workflows (especially in regard to your Apollo, but also in general), this is a good place to ask.

 

[Mattingleymike]

Thanks very much any recommendations gratefully received. Out of interest has anyone connected a Sonos Connect (or Port) to the S/PDIF of an Apollo - Can't see why it wouldn't work?

 

[c3r1c]

Thanks very much any recommendations gratefully received. Out of interest has anyone connected a Sonos Connect (or Port) to the S/PDIF of an Apollo - Can't see why it wouldn't work?

I haven't tried a Sonos Connect (or Port), but I have hooked up my RME ADAT72 via S/PDIF (coax) into my Apollo 8 without issue.

 

[Matt Hepworth]

Don't you ever sleep?

I have before. Reminds me of a pot and a kettle...

 

[chrisso]

I'm using Luna to track (simple), about 16 audio tracks (drums) plus a couple of virtual instruments. I record at 96Khz, 24 bit. I never even look at the DSP monitor. It works like a dream on a 2020 M1 MacBook.

 

[Mattingleymike]

I have before. Reminds me of a pot and a kettle...

Sleep... It's overrated...

 

[Matt Hepworth]

There is theoretically no reason to work above 44.1 kHz as that's where it's going to end up anyway. I've been at 48 kHz and 24-bit for so long it's a habit, but for my next project I may drop to 44.1/24-bit.

I met a young engineer, very green, who was very excited to tell me he was recording everything at 192 kHz. He was sure the quality would be terrific. I have no idea what he's doing now, but it surely isn't at 192. That would be like recording on tape at, say 300 inches/second or some crazy number.

One thing the higher sample rate WILL do for you is to reduce your latency, roughly by half for every doubling of the the sample rate. But that comes at a cost to CPU usage.

Realistically, 44.1/24-bit, with good analog/digital converters, is probably the best choice for most engineers in the home or semi-pro studio environment.

Since CD is pretty much a secondary delivery format now (if at all), I've finally started working at 48kHz instead. I was a VERY strong proponent of 44.1kHz for anything going to CD, but I now see the majority of targets being video or streaming, so I've reluctantly switched.

 

[Mattingleymike]

Since CD is pretty much a secondary delivery format now (if at all), I've finally started working at 48kHz instead. I was a VERY strong proponent of 44.1kHz for anything going to CD, but I now see the majority of targets being video or streaming, so I've reluctantly switched.

There does seem to be a trend towards the higher resolutions and Atmos etc in streaming platforms but it's questionable how much benefit there is in the real world.

I read somewhere about some downsides with aliasing at higher sample rates.

I suppose the overheads necessary for processing higher bitrates are largely insignificant with modern computers and ever their ever increasing CPU power.
Still can't beat a DSP for latency though...
Long live UAD2!