Simple question: NEVE and AMD8131 related

[Archmart]

Hey Hey!

I just had a thought of buying a third UAD-1 in a Flexi-Pak instead of just buying the NEVE plug... I've got he open slot, after all.

But then I remember that I've got the AMD8131 problem (Original Dual 1.8 PCI-X) and I very typically find myself maxing out at around 80% usage with the two cards.

So... would a third card help this situation or actually possibly make it worse?

I mean... If I'm maxing out because of the processor's involvement already, would the third card be of any use?

Thanks,
Archmart

 

[Archmart]

Anyone?

 

[Blatboy]

*bump* I'd like to know this too... I have an amd8131 g5 (dual 2.0) and can't seem to figure out if adding cards really helps or not... I'm in need of a higher instance count!

 

[PaulM]

I was told by someone at UAD it was a matter of diminishing returns with this chip set ( I have it also). They more cards you add the more headroom the card apparently needs to function and also the less power you get from the actual card...so you crap out of power on the third card sooner.

Well...that is how I understand what I was told....any UAD gods of technology around to answer????

Have to say - been a customer for some time of UAD but am rapidly losing interest as a LOGIC / UAD / MAC user.....the whole thing seems to be a workaround - while on DP it seems much better....

i dunno....i will probably get slammed by other users and the moderator - but hey....that is my experince of their products.....

I even called UAD once to bring to their attention in an interview with a producer on their website that he \"....tracked drums thru his UAD compressors...\" now I am no genius but I dont think you are going to be tracking anything thru a uad cos the latency is unuseable. Brett at UAD admitted this and I believe it was tweeked on the site. Bit misleading to potential purchasers/users.

just my 2 ¢ worth.....

PaulM

 

[Trace]

Since I actually have 4 cards and a PCI-X G5 with AMD 8131 i'll respond with some actual numbers:

I did a bit of testing on my system:

Dual G5 1.8Ghz PCI-X
2.5 Gb of Ram
Yamaha O1X
7 Slot 33Mhz Magma Chassis
4 UAD-1's

OSX 10.3.9 - UAD vs 4.0
I set the MIN-GNT PCI Latency to 48
AMD 8131 Comp DMA mode is off
Running 24 Channels in Cubase SX 3.0.1, ASIO Buffer at 512, 44.1k
I've posted the most instances of each plug in I could get to run stable with no Host CPU overload. # of instances listed 1st. Host CPU load and UAD-1 DSP load:


24 - Dreamverb - 20% G5 CPU & 95% UAD DSP (24 is max - so that's 100%)

40 - CS-1- 30% G5 CPU & 87% UAD DSP/92% mem (40 is max - so that's 100%)

16 - Plate 140 - 15% G5 CPU & 85% UAD DSP/43% mem (16 is max - so that's 100%)

8 - Nigel - 8% G5 CPU & 70% UAD DSP//48% mem (8 is max - so that's 100%)

28 - 1176LN - 25% G5 CPU and 95% UAD DSP (32 is max - 4 Less than max)

24 - Pultec Pro - 20% G5 CPU & 92% UAD DSP (28 is max - 4 less than max)

40 - Pultec - 28% G5 CPU & 93% UAD DSP (48 is max - 8 less than max)

40 - Fairchild 670 mono - 28% G5 CPU & 92% UAD DSP (48 is max - 8 less than max)

64 - LA2A - 45% G5 CPU & 95% UAD DSP (88 is max - so that's 24 less than max)

72 - 1176SE - 50% G5 CPU & 91% UAD DSP (128 is max - 56 less than max)

80 - Cambridge EQ's w/5 Bands - 58% G5 CPU & 89% UAD DSP (184 is max - 104 less than max)


When it comes to the bigger plug ins which will naturally limit the number of instances, there really is a value to having more UAD-1's. Its only when you want to run a ton of instances that the PCI-X tunnel limit becomes a problem.

TRACE

 

[caseyschultheis]

G5/AMD 8131 chip-set

Apple Power Mac G5 compatibility
http://www.uaudio.com/support/software/ ... ps/G5.html


Some good links to read all about it on our webzine,

http://www.uaudio.com/webzine/2005/august/index7.html

http://www.uaudio.com/webzine/2005/may/index5.html

http://www.uaudio.com/webzine/2005/March/index5.html

http://www.uaudio.com/webzine/2004/june ... tent7.html

http://www.uaudio.com/webzine/2004/febr ... tent1.html

Frequently Asked Questions
http://www.uaudio.com/support/software/UAD-1/FAQ.html

If you have any more question about this after reading all of the info on these links please call me.

Casey Schultheis

Phone Support
Toll-Free in USA!
Customer Service & Technical Support: 1-877-MY-UAUDIO (1-877-698-2834)
Business & Sales: 1-866-UAD-1176 (1-866-823-1176)
International: 1-831-466-3737
Fax: 1-831-466-3775:

Email Support
Windows: pcsupport@uaudio.com
Macintosh: macsupport@uaudio.com
Online purchases/store support: onlinesupport@uaudio.com

Support Hours
Our product specialists are available to assist you via email and telephone during our normal business hours, which are from 9am to 5pm, Monday through Friday, Pacific Standard Time.

 

[Giles117 DP]

Bottomline to this old discussion, is Magma is overall the best solution. You only run into headaches with High plugin counts going this route. For instance, a ton of CS-1's.

But if you bought UAD for the Premo plugins, 9x our of 10 you wot see that issue. Wehn I do normal (real) mixing and not just get em out the door slap a bunch of comps on everything 10 minute scratch rush mix, I never have any issues. I can get deep into mixing drums&Bass for a track and get really loaded on plugins, Pultec, 1176, Realverb, LA2A and SSL waves and with my 2 card system not beat up on my little rig. Then it's time to grab that orange Juice break and hit the freeze button.

Magma is the correct solution for us poisoned G5'ers

 

[bugsstar]

How do you come to your bottomline solution ?
Buy a system that gets connected to the same PCI-X, that gives problems, to avoid it ??

If you have 3 cards you'll get more power than just 2 cards even on PCI-X G5's.
I have a dual 2.7, i have 2 and i have them on the same buss (slowest one of the 2 busses) I can add a 3th one with no problem as it is on a different buss also.

Like you can read in the reports. If you want more power to use more pultecs, plates, dimension D's whatever has a higher cpu count... get more cards and you'll have a better system. If you use it to get more cambridge EQ's you might get problems as it deals with a higher track count to the card becauses it uses less cpu.

 

[Giles117 DP]

Easy. I put my magma mounted uad's inside my g5 and had the same issues you guys complain about. I placed them into the magma, issue Gone. Bottom Line.


Others have reported similar results.

PCI-X with AMD is a hassle. Magma is the best way to minimize it. Bottom Line.

 

[Archmart]

\"I put my magma mounted uad's inside my g5 and had the same issues you guys complain about. I placed them into the magma, issue Gone. Bottom Line.\"

Now that I haven't heard before. That's useful info. Thanks for explaining that.

Until now, it's sounded like the Magma devotees were happy but every indication was that they should actually have the same problems as the rest of us.

I wonder what actually changes things for the Magma user, since they're still going through the AMD 8131. Why don't you have to use that mode?

By the way... I tried to duplicate Trace's test results, but here's the obstacle I hit... I never get above 80% UAD DSP and I never get over 20% CPU Usage because either the CPU Usage starts to spike into the red or the next UAD plug I add UAD won't allow... With my usage set at 95%. This makes me wonder if I have a different problem.

Archmart

 

[Giles117 DP]

I had the very same issues when my cards were inside the G5 vs inside the magma. I'd hit 60% and spike out with my uad's even on one UAD. Magma was the solution. Now I hit 95% (Which is where I limited my system) no fuss, no muss.

The issue is the AMD. with the magma you dont have to compensate for the AMD as your are in effect isolating the UAD from the AMD. The magma is dealing with the AMD. SO indirectly you have an improved situation. NOT PERFECT mind you, but greatly improved.

 

[Archmart]

Hey Hey!

Thanks.

Again... Very helpful.

How'd you get your Magmas? I seem to remember in the various debates about this that often people point out the great expense of a Magma. (You can't really blame people for generally feeling reticent to pay so much for basically an empty box) But then it's usually countered that they're cheap used. Did you get yours used?

Looking at Ebay... that seems like an option they're not too much. It just looks like you have to watch for the right model to be available.

My only hesitation would be connected to the question of future compatibility. I'm already looking at the possibility of buying another UAD-1 PCI and then having 3 of the old model to get rid of when I someday upgrade to a PCI-e Mac or possibly a new MacBook Pro with ExpressCard. It would be a bummer to also then have to get rid of a PCIx to PCI Magma but it would be amazing to have the Magma actually solve that problem instead of make it worse. So I wonder if it's not such a big deal, actually. That is... Can you take a Magma chassis and just swap the connecting cable/card for a different one? (Could I buy a PCIx to PCI Magma setup now and later just change the PCIx card for a PCIe or an ExpressCard connection?) I think the answer is no, but tell me if I'm wrong.

Thanks,
Archmart

 

[Akis]

I think you should ask Magma.

 

[Silvercity-Bob]

Bangalore DeLuxe UAD

Has anyone of yours ever heard of someone who tampered his card?
Like, soldering a 3 Gigaherz chip on the UAD?
That d be quite cool huh...javascript:emoticon('8)')