• Welcome to the General Discussion forum for UAD users!

    Please note that this forum is user-run, although we're thrilled to have so much contribution from Drew, Will, and other UA folks!

    Feel free to discuss both UAD and non-UAD related subjects!

    1) Please do not post technical issues here. Please use our UAD Support Forums instead.

    2) Please do not post complaints here. Use the Unrest Forum instead. They have no place in the the General Discussion forum.

    Threads posted in the wrong forum will be moved, so if you don't see your thread here anymore, please look in the correct forum.

    Lastly, please be respectful.

UAD Precision Maximizer - Review

Plec

Venerated Member
So, UA finally decides to get into the loudness race, eh? :) ... Well, maybe not.

As always with UA's plugins there is one thing you can count on, and that is quality. Maybe you don't like this or that plugin, but there is no denying that the algorithms themselves are top notch! I have to say that the new Maximizer from UA does not disappoint. Its resemblance to the Oxford Inflator can't be denied, and as another forum member pointed out, they cancel eachother out by -40db! That is the same as Waves SSL plugins cancels against their hardware counterparts. :)

To my ears, they sound radically different though but are set out to accomplish the same task; giving you a larger than life sound! So, how can you use it? On pretty much any sound that needs an extra \"wow\" factor I would say. Complete mixes, drum subs, guitars, vocals... you name it. It can be considered the special sauce that just gels it all together, but if you use it on everything it will not taste/sound that good. I've put it through its paces the last couple of days, using it on both a mastering and mix session. So here goes!

I had just finished a mastering session that demanded some very loud average levels. Pretty much ranging from -8.5 to -6dBFS RMS. This is very hard to achieve cleanly, but as an ME I've worked for years on my loudness techniques and found the best way for me to do it, and so this was the PERFECT challenge for the Precision Maximizer, to see if it made any of my trusted techniques and tools obsolete. The first thing I reacted to was that the saturation sounded a lot like the PENTODE process on the Cranesong HEDD. Actually they sounded surprisingly similar... they even work in the same manner since the HEDD also \"mixes in\" the saturated sound with the original which makes it more transparent than other similar processes. The PENTODE process goes from 0-10, and pretty much when using the PENTODE process above 6 you start to push the programme a bit too much. When MIX equals 100% on the PM it's about the same as 7 on the HEDD... So for mastering purposes where you aim at subtle enhancement you might want to look at a MIX setting of about 50% as a good starting point.

So I just removed all of my \"loudness enhancing processes\" from the session and threw in the PM to see how well it fared. My conclusion is, better than any other single loudness maximizer I've had the pleasure of trying. But as always with loudness, it is a very fine line between something sounding good vs. over the top. This is a process where 1/4 of a db anywhere will make a big difference, so it really does take quite a while to understand how to get the cleanest, loudest result out of this box. When you go for loudness, the secret is to spread the workload out between a number of boxes that all complement eachother. 1db there, 0.5db there, 1db there... etc.... It's important to find the right tools in the right place. So, I can say that the PM did not replace or enhance any of my previous tools or techniques for gaining loudness. But that's due to the fact that it didn't \"interface\" with my other combination of tools. Using the PM solely I ended up with a 1-2db lower master than my original while having the same amount of acceptable \"grunge\" present. But consider that I normally use a combiantion of high-end hardware and plugins to gain my gain. ;)

So this is actually a very high score for the PM I think! The way to go is to get as loud a result as you can, using the cleanest tools you have, and then add the grunge to gain extra level. So, slam a Precision Limiter on your bus and limit as much as you think is musically appropriate and then add the PM just before it and tweak until you get the best of both worlds!
...
 

Plec

Venerated Member
...
Using the PM in a mix-session is very fun! It does a great job on Bass, Guitars, Vocals, Drums and just about anything you would like to sound special and upfront. GREAT for taming transient rich drumsounds where you want more \"body\", the Inflator is also good at this, and the PSP Mixsaturator and the PSP Vintage Warmer.. :) But the PM always sounds more \"open\" compared to any of the others. Which one will fit your specific needs is another story. I had a great experience using it on a cleanly recorded acoustic guitar to make the top-end have more presence and just an overall fuller sound that had more excitement to it.

So in conclucion I must say I'm very impressed with what UA have done. Even though it's great, it didn't replace any of my previous tools for loudness maximizing, but it's a great tool for giving a mix more sheen, presence and impact where needed and when used subtly. It's also great for using on your master-bus when mixing to \"check\" how loud you can make it before sounding akward and if something needs to be changed in the mix before mastering, to later be able to achieve as good a result as possible. A great rule when working with saturation and distortion for enhancement purposes is that when you really start to hear a change in the sound, you've taken it a bit too far.
 

timmcallister

Active Member
Thanks for the review.

I've got the $200 voucher and was going to reluctantly pick up the 33609 and 1081. I say reluctantly, as the reality is I find I can't use the 33609 full version as UADs inability to load balance plugs pretty much kills my system with the 33609 on a card. I've posted long winded comments about this in other threads, so I'll let it die... I didn't \"need\" the 1081 as between the 88rs and the 1073 i feel I have my bases covered. But with this months promo, I could get them both for $50, so what the heck I thought.

Well... true to form, UAD releases a few new plugs a week before months end, and what do ya know. An inflator... I had been looking at the sonnex as another plug when I need something loud that won't be going to an ME.

Recently, I've been using a combination of clipping and the Precision limiter. I've found clipping to be a very attractive method, as it sounds SO MUCH better than heavy limiting (thank you for not killing the snare!). Now with the Maximizer, this may a great third tool to get em hot when you need to.

I'll try the demo out this weekend, but I am thinking... I will use my $200 voucher to pick up the maximizer for free, and pass on the 33609 and 1081
 

Yiannis

Active Member
Plec,

thank you very much for this rewiew.

I have two questions please!

1) Does PM replaces the HEDD?

2) I have the HEDD ,do I need the PM too ?
 

Dan Duskin

Established Member
timmcallister said:
Recently, I've been using a combination of clipping and the Precision limiter. I've found clipping to be a very attractive method, as it sounds SO MUCH better than heavy limiting (thank you for not killing the snare!).
That works well for drums... but you have to be very carefull, because as soon as the song goes to a part with no drums and just a rhythm guitar with long sustaining chords you will start to hear digital clipping in the very high frequencies (sounds like pops, clicks, and static).

If the mastering engineer is good, he/she won't kill your snare.
 

LFranco

Venerated Member
I've got a HEDD (192) also, and while I haven't tried the PM yet to see how it sounds in comparison to the process on the HEDD, I doubt it would replace the HEDD! I guess the PM does what the HEDD does with regards to the triode/pentode process, but the HEDD also has a \"tape\" process, it does 16 and 20 bit dithering and it's a pretty kick ass AD/DA converter!!
 

Cass Anawaty

Shareholder
Thanks Plec,
I'm interested to hear not about loudness, but about character on a \"normal\" sounding mix.

You mentioned the pentode mode of the HEDD--would you be comfortable applying subtle amount of the maximizer simply for a slight saturation effect?

Cass

PS. -6dbfs rms? You're killin' me. :p
 

Cass Anawaty

Shareholder
LFranco said:
I guess the PM does what the HEDD does with regards to the triode/pentode process, but the HEDD also has a "tape" process
Yeah, but the older models don't :cry:

I've got the HEDD 192 in my sights, but it's a ways off. If I could get a similiar effect, I'd be interested. I've used one in the past, but it's been a while and would like to hear comments from those who can do a comparison.
 

LFranco

Venerated Member
Cass Anawaty said:
If I could get a similiar effect, I'd be interested. I've used one in the past, but it's been a while and would like to hear comments from those who can do a comparison.
I think if you're looking at the HEDD 192 mainly for the processing, I would definitely NOT get it, and get plugins instead. Plec already said how he feels the process is close to the HEDD (he's talking about the Pentiode process only though). As far as the tape process, if UA comes out with a tape effect soon, that'll probably have what the HEDD does as far as processing covered. I have tried the massey tape plug that everyone likes a lot and compared it to the HEDD and the HEDD process was "warmer" (don't want to say "better" or more "realistic" since it's all subjective) and liked the HEDD better for that.

I'd consider the HEDD heavily if you're going to go DA and then AD with it for sure though.
 

timmcallister

Active Member
Dan Duskin said:
That works well for drums... but you have to be very carefull, because as soon as the song goes to a part with no drums and just a rhythm guitar with long sustaining chords you will start to hear digital clipping in the very high frequencies (sounds like pops, clicks, and static).

If the mastering engineer is good, he/she won't kill your snare.

i recall qualifying my statement by stating "when I need something loud that won't be going to an ME"

as far as clipping, just like limiting, compression or anything else, results are dependent on your skill, ears, room, source material AND targeted listener and playback device.

clipping works wonders for my work.
 
Try the MAXIMER ON SNARE!!!!!! It really ROCKS !!!!!!!!!

I don't know how you guys feel about the maximizer. I love it. At first i didn't know what to do with it but today i tried it on a rock tune.

WOW!!! :D :D :idea: :idea:

I put it on the snare with shape between 50-100 & and the input very hot and the limiter on. Wow ! Punchy as hell !!!!!!
I used an eq before with lots of mid and high boost and some locut. the snare really popped and cut through the guitars. very nice.

also on kick drum and bass it was very nice and you can chance the tone from subtle to gritty. it really sounds like a tube, a bit like my 2-610 preamp when overdriven. cool to have that in my DAW now

thanks UA!!!



Kev :!: :!: :!: :!: :D :D :D :D
 

Arys Chien

Active Member
timmcallister said:
as far as clipping, just like limiting, compression or anything else, results are dependent on your skill, ears, room, source material AND targeted listener and playback device.

clipping works wonders for my work.
I would love to hear some example of any "wonderful clipping".

What's more, I would love to hear some example of any wonderful clipping that wouldn't become much more noticable after mastering. As far as I know, any subtle clipping has a great chance of becoming very audiable after more than one processing, analog or digital.

I myself avoid clipping as much as possible, although that I'd still be too careless once in a while and let some pass through my guard, which I always definitely regret afterwards.
 

Macc

Established Member
I tried PM for half an hour or more today...

:|

I need to spend more time with it, but definitely :|
 

Plec

Venerated Member
The PM won't replace the need for a HEDD. First because you have the TAPE process there which is just AWESOME sometimes, and also because the PENTODE process sounds a bit smoother than the PM saturator, but they are very similar. I think it would be really tough telling them apart on subtler settings, but as you push the envelope it becomes more and more clear.

I personally think that a mix setting of 100% is too much on a whole mix in 99% of cases. If and when I use the PENTODE process on the HEDD, it won't be over 5 or 6. That's really pushing it and becomes too apparent I think. 50% mix on the PM equals a setting of just below 6 on the HEDD for similar results. Most mastering people I've encountered seem to prefer no more than 2-4 (about 20-40%) on a mix, so that's a good guideline.

I have not managed to become friends with the \"limiter/soft saturator\". It seems to me that it's just too coloured for anything other than an effect. I've gotten much better results using a limiter or a good clipper after the PM. I will try this a bit more though and see where it has it's uses. DEFINITELY one of the hardest boxes to master that UA has put out. It's always a hassle learning how and where to use certain types of distortion. Always trial & error until you find the sweetspot for it.
 

Arys Chien

Active Member
I'm going to buy the PreMax.

I don't think that I'll use it on the master bus, and I'm not sure what instrument to use it on yet. I HAVE, however, heard some nice and musical result during the time I tried it, which I've never heard from any other plug-ins (and I do have the Inflator), and that is good enough a reason for me to buy it and believe that it will have its use somewhere some time.

Yet I think the PreMax (or any similar) really has to be used with great care. The more intense I use it, the more \"fake\" it sounds.....
 

Awesom-o

Active Member
I seem to be able to get very similar results to the Precision Maximizer by dialling in some parallel compression using a 1176LN and blending it in with the original.

$199 saved :)
 

Macc

Established Member
Awesom-o said:
I seem to be able to get very similar results to the Precision Maximizer by dialling in some parallel compression using a 1176LN and blending it in with the original.

$199 saved :)


I'll try that - I found a nice use for my music for the PM - making low low bass more aggressive - but this could save me $199 too :)

Cheers!
 

Cabbage

Active Member
Seems to me the PMax is not that unique (nor is Inflator), you can pretty much achieve the same thing by other means. But it is a VERY convenient package!

For me, it is always a problem when I deliver a rough mix and the level is too low. People start to worry about the level, and not what it sounds like. When I give someone a mix, I will limit it a bit, slap on Inflator and then you are at a decent level. The higher level is much more apparent than the distortion to most people.

Petter
 
UAD Bundle Month
Top