Volume on the bass vs volume on amp sim when running DI unison on Apollo twin

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Nickvegas

Active Member
I have asled a similar question before, but I am still slightly confused how to get the bast sound out of my bass when going through hi Z on my apollo twin.


I am trying to find which bass amp I like, currently using the ampeg SVT 3 pro. I really just want a clean fat and full bass sound.

what is the common gain staging practice of volume control. I know I would be hitting about -11ish db, should my guitar volume knob be all the way up and the adjustment comes from the unison preamp volume? should it be half up and half unison pre amp adjustment?

its weird I cant seem to get a very loud/full sound without getting into the sub -8db zone, but is that too hot to record with? I find my monitor volume is maxed out and I am barley getting any presence. Where as if im playing back my tracks or a midi instrument from my keyboard with similar input gain, my monitor are barely turned up at all, like not even half way. same for any non DAW audio like youtube/spotify so I know my monitors are sensitive and have a very loud output.

is there any gain staging magic I am missing for bass/guitar direct?
 
UA_User

UA_User

Hall of Fame Member
I'm of the "all the way up" school on any bass or guitar output knobs, unless the input stage of the receiving device is clipping at lowest gain.

Monitoring: sounds like you're possibly using up the headroom on deep bass frequencies that aren't easy to hear, or that are even below your monitors response. Does your bass have any EQ knobs on it to dial in some more bark in the mids? You can also use random EQ's on the Apollo (personally, I've never met an amp sim where I didn't need to use a separate EQ to get the results I want). Even if you don't print them, it might help for hearing yourself while recording.
 
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Nickvegas

Active Member
UA_User said:
No way to answer where your bass output volume knob should be; depends on the pickups, active passive, etc. I'm of the "all the way up" school on any bass or guitar output knobs, unless the input stage of the receiving device is clipping at lowest gain.

Monitoring: sounds like you're possibly using up the headroom on deep bass frequencies that aren't easy to hear, or that are even below your monitors response. Does your bass have some EQ on it to get some more bark in the mids? You can also use random EQ's on the Apollo (personally, I've never met an amp sim where I didn't need to use a separate EQ to get the results I want). Even if you don't print them, it might help for hearing yourself while recording.
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Are these what you mean here? Looks like I could turn up some mids! I have the first cranked all the way up!

As far as the input gain, what do you recommend it being at? I hear people say the input gain should usually be around -12 or -11db
 

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UA_User

UA_User

Hall of Fame Member
Nickvegas said:
As far as the input gain, what do you recommend it being at? I hear people say the input gain should usually be around -12 or -11db
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For a bass, I vote for "crank whatever amp or input you're running into until it sounds good" (without digital clipping, of course).

Just my opinion, but digital bass amp and speaker sims often just scoop and darken the tone, and add a lot of deep bass and string noise to my ears, which is usually the opposite of what is needed for recordings of bass in a mix. The exception is noticeably overdriven or fuzz bass, where the bass amp sims are helpful.
 
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Nickvegas

Active Member
UA_User said:
For what, the hi-z input?

For a bass, I vote for "crank whatever amp or input you're running into until it sounds good" (without digital clipping, of course).
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Yes hi-z!

so if it starts sounding good like, sub -10 or even -8 without clipping (I suppose
That’s past 0 right) I could do that? Would same go for hi-z guitar? I know other instruments/vocals have to be a little more careful with the gain staging!
 
UA_User

UA_User

Hall of Fame Member
Nickvegas said:
Yes hi-z!

so if it starts sounding good like, sub -10 or even -8 without clipping (I suppose
That’s past 0 right) I could do that? Would same go for hi-z guitar? I know other instruments/vocals have to be a little more careful with the gain staging!
Click to expand...
Probably the slight non-linearities that inputs and preamps exhibit when running hot will just improve the bass tone.

If the bass amp sim you have ain't workin for ya even after tweaking it's knobs, you've still got plenty of toys to play with in your Apollo to get a direct bass signal sounding mix-ready!

I'm finding the Helios preamp/EQ plugin to interact well with my 5-string (which has active pickups). YMMV
 
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Nickvegas

Active Member
UA_User said:
Probably the slight non-linearities that inputs and preamps exhibit when running hot will just improve the bass tone.

If the bass amp sim you have ain't workin for ya even after tweaking it's knobs, you've still got plenty of toys to play with in your Apollo to get a direct bass signal sounding mix-ready!

I'm finding the Helios preamp/EQ plugin to interact well with my 5-string (which has active pickups). YMMV
Click to expand...
Awesome thanks for the advice! I was looking at the Helios pre amp! All I want is a fat clean/warm bass sound haha!
 
UA_User

UA_User

Hall of Fame Member
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UA_User

UA_User

Hall of Fame Member
One more thing, now that I know you have them, try

Century Tube Channel -> Oxide.

Just those 2 can do the trick, depending on the song.
 
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