Whats difference between Apollos?

[gregsbbn]

I'm about to purchase an Apollo Twin, but I saw that there are some models and I was confused about it.

As far as I was able to research, I discovered 3 Apollo models:

- Apollo Twin (silver)
- Apollo Twin (gray)
- Apollo Twin X (gray too)

Is there any hardware difference in them? Or just aesthetic and carrying thunderbolt.

Thank you.

 

[RogueM]

well, OBVIOUSLY, the latest is a “potent sonic update to the world's most popular professional desktop audio interface”.

…. yeah, me neither

 

[rodd]

The twin (silver, non-X) is usb and windows only. The twin mkii is the previous gen (however still current), and the twin x is the latest. The usb twin X is Windows only. The X Apollos have better preamps and converters, but if you look at the specs (in the manual) it’s subtle on paper. You can also get a quad dsp version of the thunderbolt X. You may or may not be able to hear the difference in audio quality, and with so many plugins being ported to native you may not need a quad. So many options .

 

[gregsbbn]

The twin (silver, non-X) is usb and windows only. The twin mkii is the previous gen (however still current), and the twin x is the latest. The usb twin X is Windows only. The X Apollos have better preamps and converters, but if you look at the specs (in the manual) it’s subtle on paper. You can also get a quad dsp version of the thunderbolt X. You may or may not be able to hear the difference in audio quality, and with so many plugins being ported to native you may not need a quad. So many options .

I understand, I'm looking to get some on the used market and I found two options (Silver and MKII) and my intention is to improve the quality of my mixes. Today I have a Steinberg UR44.

The question is if I get a Silver will I have good quality to hear the mix elements clearly? (I know it doesn't just depend on the interface, but Silver would do the trick)

 

[rodd]

I don’t know the steinberg ur44, but it’s unlikely that an interface change alone is going to net you a noticeable difference in sound quality. There are lots of good reasons to get an Apollo, but if you’re just chasing sound quality that’s probably not the place to start. What are you recording? What mics do you use (if any)?

 

[gregsbbn]

I don’t know the steinberg ur44, but it’s unlikely that an interface change alone is going to net you a noticeable difference in sound quality. There are lots of good reasons to get an Apollo, but if you’re just chasing sound quality that’s probably not the place to start. What are you recording? What mics do you use (if any)?

So what is my setup:
- Ur44 interface
- Hs7 Yamaha
- Mac mini m1
- AKG C414 and MXL 990/991
- An acoustically controlled room

And my mixes always feel like there's a blanket over the entire mix. A colleague of mine who has the same setup but instead of the Ur44 has an Apollo, and talking to him, the issue is that the converters on my interface are not that good for mixing because I can't hear the treble clearly and that's what's causing the I don't have clarity, and I can't make good decisions in the mix.

 

[rodd]

@Matt Hepworth may be able to help on the specs of the silver twin vs the ur44. I did some quick looking and it seems the ur44 is decent for its price, but I’m not sure how that would compare to an older Apollo.

 

[slamthecrank]

It may not be the converters in the Steinberg unit - have you tried to do a mix using different monitors? Those Yamaha HS7's are notoriously bright... which means that you'll probably be adjusting for that in the mix, causing your final mix to be too dull.

I do think that the converters in the UA interface are better, but I have a feeling that you are probably reacting to the brightness of those monitors more than anything to do with the interface. Might be worth a shot to try new monitors, if possible. (If it does turn out that you were compensating for the monitors, then a new interface is definitely not going to help)

I'm not familiar with the MXL 990/99, but the AKG C414 (depending on the suffix) can be a pretty bright microphone as well. This is what makes me think you are hearing too much highs, not enough low mids, during the mix stage - and thus, overcompensating for it, causing a dull, blanketed mix.

 

[UA_User]

my intention is to improve the quality of my mixes. Today I have a Steinberg UR44.
The question is if I get a Silver will I have good quality to hear the mix elements clearly?

Realistically, your D/A, unless broken or pure trash, is not likely to be a big factor in making your mixes better, except perhaps psychologically.

Consumer D/A in an old CD player from the 80's and 90's was already plenty good!

Apollo is a cool interface if you need it's features.

 

[Joe Porto]

Silver does not have unison DI.

 

[gregsbbn]

Realistically, your D/A, unless broken or pure trash, is not likely to be a big factor in making your mixes better, except perhaps psychologically.

Consumer D/A in an old CD player from the 80's and 90's was already plenty good.

Your buddy is likely wrong. Pretty much any factor in your listening setup is more apt to cause you problems than your D/A (again, unless your D/A is broken or trash).

If your mixes are too muffled, either your speakers are too bright, or your room acoustics are really flawed, or you haven't listened to and tried to match reference material on your speakers to learn how they translate.

You could always make sure your D/A isn't broken by running a proper test through it and measuring it.

Having said all that, Apollo is a cool interface if you need it's features.

I'm going to post two works here (I don't know if it's allowed, if not let me know and I'll delete it) so you can get an idea of the mixing level.

SONG #1

Soundcloud link: https://soundcloud.com/gregsebben%2Famanha_master
Spotify link: https://open.spotify.com/intl-pt/track/5iKUCNPaCu6yT2vm8eTd5F?si=a4b51a7b500f4856


SONG #2

Soundcloud link: https://soundcloud.com/gregsebben%2Fesperanca_master
Spotify link: https://open.spotify.com/intl-pt/track/0ToheQBiF5LJffaEQx770V?si=838b258b2be741a7

 

[UA_User]

I'm going to post two works here (I don't know if it's allowed, if not let me know and I'll delete it) so you can get an idea of the mixing level.

SONG #1

Soundcloud link: https://soundcloud.com/gregsebben%2Famanha_master
Spotify link: https://open.spotify.com/intl-pt/track/5iKUCNPaCu6yT2vm8eTd5F?si=a4b51a7b500f4856


SONG #2

Soundcloud link: https://soundcloud.com/gregsebben%2Fesperanca_master
Spotify link: https://open.spotify.com/intl-pt/track/0ToheQBiF5LJffaEQx770V?si=838b258b2be741a7

It's more important for you to compare your own mixes to known quality reference mixes in your own listening environment.

EDIT: forgot to mention that your soundcloud link doesn't work!

 

[gregsbbn]

It's more important for you to compare your own mixes to known quality reference mixes in your own listening environment. If the latter sound good in your environment, then your gear is fine. If your mixes sound muddy when A/B'd against them, it makes it clear what tweaks are needed in your mix.

So the conclusion would be if I keep all my setup and change the interface will I hear the sound the same way?

 

[UA_User]

So the conclusion would be if I keep all my setup and change the interface will I hear the sound the same way?

Unless your D/A is broken or exceptionally bad somehow, this just isn't an issue.

Apollo D/A is fine. Used $50 Focusrite Scarlett Solo D/A is also fine. Old Soundblaster card D/A is good enough to mix on.

 

[Matt Hepworth]

Silver does not have unison DI.

Twin does. Only the rack Silverfaces don't.

 

[Matt Hepworth]

I'm about to purchase an Apollo Twin, but I saw that there are some models and I was confused about it.

As far as I was able to research, I discovered 3 Apollo models:

- Apollo Twin (silver)
- Apollo Twin (gray)
- Apollo Twin X (gray too)

Is there any hardware difference in them? Or just aesthetic and carrying thunderbolt.

Thank you.

Silver was available as SOLO or DUO on Thunderbolt (Mac and Win) and USB (Win)
It's pretty good sounding, all things considered.

Grey (mk II) has similar AD, better DA (115dB vs 120dB), built-in Talkback, and was available with a QUAD DSP as well.

Twin X has better AD, quite a bit better DA, but a slightly higher latency at 48kHz and below. (123dB AD and 126dB DA).

All have the same preamps.

 

[gregsbbn]

Silver was available as SOLO or DUO on Thunderbolt (Mac and Win) and USB (Win)
It's pretty good sounding, all things considered.

Grey (mk II) has similar AD, better DA (115dB vs 120dB), built-in Talkback, and was available with a QUAD DSP as well.

Twin X has better AD, quite a bit better DA, but a slightly higher latency at 48kHz and below. (123dB AD and 126dB DA).

All have the same preamps.

It was the summary I was looking for. But the issue of converters is still not clear, there are very different opinions on the internet. I'll listen to the more detailed mix on an interface with better converters comparing an Apollo and a cheap scarlet?

 

[Matt Hepworth]

It was the summary I was looking for. But the issue of converters is still not clear, there are very different opinions on the internet. I'll listen to the more detailed mix on an interface with better converters comparing an Apollo and a cheap scarlet?

Subjectively, some people may like some converters better than others.

Objectively, Apollos spec very well.

Silver 117dB AD, 115dB DA
Grey 118dB AD, 120dB DA
Twin X 123dB AD, 126dB DA

 

[Tsadar]

Silver was available as SOLO or DUO on Thunderbolt (Mac and Win) and USB (Win)
It's pretty good sounding, all things considered.

Grey (mk II) has similar AD, better DA (115dB vs 120dB), built-in Talkback, and was available with a QUAD DSP as well.

Twin X has better AD, quite a bit better DA, but a slightly higher latency at 48kHz and below. (123dB AD and 126dB DA).

All have the same preamps.

Oh, I didn’t know about the latency differencies. Why’s that?

 

[Matt Hepworth]

Oh, I didn’t know about the latency differencies. Why’s that?

At 96kHz they're all the same, but often higher quality conversion (DA, in this case) has a little higher latency. It's about 0.7ms additional on the X series at 48kHz or 44.1kHz.