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UAD Plugin Gain Staging Chart?

P

Prado Escondido

Shareholder
Does UAD publish a chart of the recommended gain settings in dBFS for their various plugins?

I'd like to see it all in one place like the instances chart instead of searching thru the manual plugin by plugin.

Or, have any of you created one?

Thanks.
 
Hoenerbr

Hoenerbr

Hall of Fame Member
Prado Escondido said:
Does UAD publish a chart of the recommended gain settings in dBFS for their various plugins?

I'd like to see it all in one place like the instances chart instead of searching thru the manual plugin by plugin.

Or, have any of you created one?

Thanks.
Click to expand...
I don't think so. Its a great idea though! I think its in the manual for each plugin, but a chart would be awesome! I often thought that if the insert slots in our DAWS had a Red/Green led on the left and right for input and output levels that were optimized for the plugin that was inserted (Info coming from Plugin Manufacturer) it would make things a lot easier.
 
Matt Hepworth

Matt Hepworth

Master of the UADiverse
Forum Admin
Moderator
I think I did see that one of us had one. If they can post a link I'll sticky it.
 
S

Spaceman-56

Member
Matt Hepworth said:
I think I did see that one of us had one. If they can post a link I'll sticky it.
Click to expand...
thanks matt. many people would benefit from the suggestion from Hoenerbr below. lots of good plugs sound really bad when the levels are too hot. not just UAD, it the same with Waves.

another idea would be to have -10 or +4 input attenuation option.

i am gaining down some plugs -8db to get better results. thanks Spaceman
 
maximus

maximus

Established Member
This would be a very useful reference to have !
 
maximus

maximus

Established Member
B

bt2513

Member
This is very interesting (along with the anti-aliasing info in the manual). Can someone explain to a n00b like myself how to put this gain stage info to good use?
 
D

d0gmA

Active Member
I used to manually gain stage everything by sticking a meter in front of it. Now I Have found a very useful and very cheap plugin from Hornet that does all of the work for me. https://www.hornetplugins.com/plugins/hornet-vu-meter-mk3/
After I import all my tracks into my session I simply stick Hornet VU Meter on each track and assign them all to the same group. Click auto and play back the entire track and it will gain stage each track to -18dbfs. Click stop and viola all tracks are gain staged. Well worth the $5 it costs and no I am not associated with Hornet at all. I just don't understand why more plugins don't just automatically gain stage themselves. Seems that would make it much handier for us.
 
B

bt2513

Member
In other words, introducing each track at the operating gain stage of the plugin ostensibly optimizes my results? I actually already own that Hornet plugin, by happenstance.
 
maximus

maximus

Established Member
How does this hornet plugin work in a mix context, do you need to play the track through for it to analyze or something?

Setting up clip gain by eye for a large amount of channels can be a bit boring, so I can definitely see the appeal.

I assume it should make no footprint on the audio other than gaining, right?
 
Myramyd

Myramyd

Venerated Member
slamthecrank said:
Here ya go... it's page 709 in the current UAD Manual.

Click to expand...
Yeah, a sticky of this would be great.

It makes some sense, I've noticed it when hitting things too hard post compression. I've hit the Studer too hard having in last in the chain before and it sounded really "off" to me regardless of where I set the input gain on it. Same on a few others, always post compression.

Also very handy to have numbers to tie to what those headroom trims are doing on some of those bus compressors!

J
 
P

Prado Escondido

Shareholder
Prado Escondido said:
Mucho gracias, amigo!
Click to expand...
Probably just me, but I can't get my head around the two columns. Why does it seem to say that a lower dBFS leads to a higher dBu?

So taking the first row, 'Most UAD Plugins,' I'd think the -18 dBFS (-18 +4 +18 ) would equal +4 dBu.

Down the chart across the rows the lower the dBFS, the higher the dBu?

I get the recommended level to hit the plugin, but not the column on the right.

Thanks.
 
Last edited:
slamthecrank

slamthecrank

Hall of Fame Member
It explains it right above the chart...

"0 dBFS is calibrated to +4dBu with 18dB of headroom, so 0dBFS is the equivalent of +22dBu in the analog domain."

Seem pretty straightforward to me. It's just giving you analog domain's equivalent in the right hand column. You don't really need this information if you're not sending anything outboard and wanting to meter it on the analog side.
 
P

Prado Escondido

Shareholder
slamthecrank said:
It explains it right above the chart...

"0 dBFS is calibrated to +4dBu with 18dB of headroom, so 0dBFS is the equivalent of +22dBu in the analog domain."

Seem pretty straightforward to me. It's just giving you analog domain's equivalent in the right hand column. You don't really need this information if you're not sending anything outboard and wanting to meter it on the analog side.
Click to expand...
Yes ... I understand that 0 dBFS = +22 dBu.

What I don't understand is why a higher internal operating level, take the Ampex for an example, of -12 dBFS results in or is equivalent of a lower dBu of +16 than 'most UAD plugins' with -18 dBFS and +22 dBu. Relatively speaking, I'd expect a higher dBFS to always have a higher dBu. But the chart seems to show the opposite.

Then again, I may completely misunderstand what 'internal operating level' really means. Simplistically, I understand it as the ideal level to hit the plugin to take advantage of the analog modeling.

Or, is the second column indicative of how much headroom is left over after hitting the plugin at the 'internal operating level?' That math makes sense.
 
D

d0gmA

Active Member
Yes it anaylyzes the track and gain stages it for you. I just did a mix with 45 tracks and all ya have to do is link all 45 tracks, stick hornet vu on them all and set them all to group 1, then unlink the tracks and open up one instance and click gain to set the entire group to auto, play your entire track and then every track is ready for plugs. A huge time saver.
 
M

mwd

Active Member
Prado Escondido said:
Or, is the second column indicative of how much headroom...
Click to expand...
The chart is a bit confusing. It's showing headroom on the right column. I think more in terms of VU meter whereas -18dBFS (UK) and -20dBFS (US) is the purported equivalent of 0 VU. With 4dBu in the red section. 18+4 is the 22 dBu referenced on the first line in the chart. 20+4 would be considered the 24dBu analog range before clip (usually). This is my perception which is totally subject to being wrong...lol.
 
Don Schenk

Don Schenk

Administrator
Forum Admin
Moderator
d0gmA said:
I used to manually gain stage everything by sticking a meter in front of it. Now I Have found a very useful and very cheap plugin from Hornet that does all of the work for me. https://www.hornetplugins.com/plugins/hornet-vu-meter-mk3/
Click to expand...
The Hornet Vu Meter MkII matches your tracks to similar levels. But it doesn't gainstage between plugins. We also need to keep track of the input and output levels of plugins. If you put 3 plug-ins on the same track, they need to be gainstaged to each other.

Can the Hornet be placed between plug-ins too?

:- Don
 
D

d0gmA

Active Member
Don Schenk said:
The Hornet Vu Meter MkII matches your tracks to similar levels. But it doesn't gainstage between plugins. We also need to keep track of the input and output levels of plugins. If you put 3 plug-ins on the same track, they need to be gainstaged to each other.

Can the Hornet be placed between plug-ins too?

:- Don
Click to expand...
Yes and it requires hardly any cpu to be noticeable. I think they have a demo too
 
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